Aug 12, 2019 15:44:50 GMT
Biggles
Normal Violet
Posts: 165
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Post by Biggles on Sept 30, 2021 20:28:38 GMT
Tonight the mum got aggressive towards the chicks, not badly, but pecking and pulling their feathers if they came near. I went to move her out, and the dad got out and went straight into the other cage too. He's positioned himself at the back and isn't coming near enough to catch. They're spent the last ten minutes flying round in circles and vigorously mating. I think they're enjoying themselves. So I thought I'd leave them there for tonight. Now what's the best thing to do? 1. Try and catch the dad only and put him back with the chicks. 2. Keep them separated. 3. Move the chicks into the main cage too. There's only one budgie currently in the main cage. Poor Biggles is sitting by the door with an expression of "my peace and quiet has been shattered." They're sitting on his favourite perch AND eating his seed. Life isn't fair!
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Post by clt80 on Sept 30, 2021 21:00:55 GMT
They are wanting to start another clutch hence the aggression and then the mating. Remove the dad and put him with the chicks so he can look after them until they can look after themselves.
The hen needs to get her energy back up and another clutch now would seriously deplete it.
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Aug 12, 2019 15:44:50 GMT
Biggles
Normal Violet
Posts: 165
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Post by Biggles on Sept 30, 2021 21:18:35 GMT
Right I'll try and catch the dad tomorrow morning.
I don't want the hen having another clutch straight away. She was so tired with the first one.
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Post by Hezz on Sept 30, 2021 22:11:59 GMT
The sooner you remove the cock the better, especially if they have already started trying for another clutch. I wouldn’t be waiting for the morning.
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Aug 12, 2019 15:44:50 GMT
Biggles
Normal Violet
Posts: 165
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Post by Biggles on Oct 1, 2021 10:11:56 GMT
The sooner you remove the cock the better, especially if they have already started trying for another clutch. I wouldn’t be waiting for the morning. I removed both parents overnight, and there is no nestbox in the cage they're now in. The chicks were all happily eating this morning when I got up.
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Aug 12, 2019 15:44:50 GMT
Biggles
Normal Violet
Posts: 165
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Post by Biggles on Oct 1, 2021 10:49:33 GMT
Have managed to catch dad this morning surprisingly easy. I let him out to fly round the room and he went straight under a chair so got him in a net. The chicks were delighted to see him ("food", "me too" "food now"!) Not sure he was quite so keen. One question is if mum was getting ready to lay again, what happens to the eggs inside her? Will she just lay them anyway (no nest box) or will she absorb them? Thanks for all the help.
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Aug 12, 2019 15:44:50 GMT
Biggles
Normal Violet
Posts: 165
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Post by Biggles on Oct 2, 2021 9:52:49 GMT
I have the answer to my last question. This morning there was an egg on the floor of the main cage.
I removed it, but the hen got very distressed, so I've put a fake one back in. It was stone cold though so I doubt it would have come to anything. Didn't expect it only 4 weeks later. Does this mean she's likely to continue laying a full breed?
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Aug 12, 2019 15:44:50 GMT
Biggles
Normal Violet
Posts: 165
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Post by Biggles on Oct 2, 2021 11:24:28 GMT
Sorry! Another question from this morning. At the bottom of the cage we have these seed dishes that we don't use for seed. (see picture) Violet has just spent the last half hour climbing in and out of these, having never had any interest before in them. Is she looking for a place to lay her eggs? If she is, and is going to lay them anyway, would it be better to put a nest box in and replace the eggs with fakes as she lays them. She does seem a bit distressed, and is shouting for her mate. (between eating, getting stuck in seed dishes and admiring herself in the mirror) The other question is do budgies mate for life or do I have to watch her going off with Biggles!
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Post by Hezz on Oct 3, 2021 1:22:26 GMT
I think the answer to most of those questions depends on how strong her urge to go another round is. I would have her in her own cage, even in a different room to the others. What you need to be doing is stressing her a little, moving her on from the feeling of everything being plentiful and therefore perfect breeding conditions, to not such a good season and survival needs to come first. Obviously you don’t want to cause her to stress out too much, but enough to reconsider the need to breed again. This means you may have to reconsider what she is eating, and how much, put the treats away for now, no millet sprays or honey sticks, healthy greens etc but no fatty seeds such as groats and sunflower seeds. She may lay another egg or two, depending on how keen she is, but do not give her anything that could be used as a nest.
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Post by Morgan on Oct 3, 2021 8:10:34 GMT
You can also look up an “austerity diet” for budgerigars to help with what to feed / not to feed. If she is currently laying make sure she still has access to a calcium block, but you can otherwise stop feeding wet/fresh foods and start her on a short period of mostly plain dry foods. Reducing protein is a must.
Since she has already mated again she may not take interest in the new male, but it isn’t a good idea to leave her with any potential mate. If she is in a cage she was previously familiar with, you probably want to rearrange the interior of the cage, move the cage to a completely new location (different room), place it lower to the ground than usual (budgies prefer to nest up higher if they can), and make sure there are no dark books or crannies, cavities, even bowls as you can already see she will use almost anything as a nest if she is already producing eggs.
You can put fake eggs down to replace the ones she lays on the floor of the cage, and even add extras (just give her a full clutch from the start) to keep her from laying another full clutch herself. Even if she doesn’t hatch them the simple act of laying them takes a toll on the body. So if you can prevent it that would be best for her health.
I wouldn’t give her a nest box, just leave her eggs right there on the floor. She should lose interest more quickly this way. You can also take her entire cage outside so she can get some fresh air and sunlight, if it’s manageable. This should help disrupt her feeling of safety to be able to raise another clutch.
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Aug 12, 2019 15:44:50 GMT
Biggles
Normal Violet
Posts: 165
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Post by Biggles on Oct 3, 2021 17:06:05 GMT
The only interest she has in the new male is if he's eating something she wants when she pecks him (he retreats), and I don't have another cage other than the little fabric travel one I have, which is far too small to keep them in. He's currently out exploring the room anyway, which is good as he needs a bit of exercise because he's put on a bit of weight with being the only budgie in the cage I've stopped their spinach supply and she now just has basic grain and a small amount of egg food. Is a calcium block the same as the pink iodine one? They have that and a cuttle fishbone too. Dad's having a hard time too. He's only coming out of the nest box to call for her, eat, and go back in again. When the chicks want feeding he expects them to go to him. I'm feeling very mean. The chicks think that coming out is immense fun. As soon as one of us goes into the room, they're all calling by the gate to be let out. They love coming out and having a fly, and are really good about going back again after, which is fantastic. One of them likes to sit on a shoulder, which is very cute.
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Post by Hezz on Oct 4, 2021 0:16:56 GMT
Iodine block here is not the same as a calcium block, but I think some do combine the two. You’d have to check what yours is. I would really urge you to consider buying another cage to put your hen in as otherwise you do run the very real risk of her going through the full clutch raising again. From now on, for every egg she lays, put in two dummies but definitely leave them on the floor of the cage. She should lose interest relatively quickly.
I would also remove the nest box from the other cage as well. You don’t want the father to start getting ideas with any of the chicks. If you can’t remove it, block the hole.
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Post by Morgan on Oct 4, 2021 9:20:36 GMT
I would also stop giving her any egg food at all. Extra protein will keep her in breeding condition and she doesn’t need it for herself. When she is no longer interested in laying you can slowly add in her other foods. Don’t give her a lot of it abruptly though or it could singla her to breed al over again if other conditions are still right for it.
Limiting her daylight hours and changing up the interior of her cage, moving the cage to a ne location, etc. are all key to snapping her out of it quickly.
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Aug 12, 2019 15:44:50 GMT
Biggles
Normal Violet
Posts: 165
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Post by Biggles on Oct 4, 2021 17:00:05 GMT
If I'm not giving her greens, nor egg food isn't that going to compromise her health a bit? Or is there something I can give her which will replace those without encouraging egg laying?
So far she's investigated the seed trays (too small), the basketball net (she got stuck and had to be rescued), under the newspaper (stuck the edges down so she can't do that again) and finally laid her egg from the top of the cage where it cracked. She then tucked herself into the corner with her wings held outwards and refused to move.
I am feeling very mean, even if it's best for her.
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Post by Hezz on Oct 5, 2021 0:18:54 GMT
You can certainly give her greens, but limit the amount of seed and millet, loose or spray, and I agree with stopping the eggfood for the time being. A new cage will also do all those other things that help break the cycle - new cage furniture, new feed and water pots, and also if she has a favourite swing for sleeping, don’t give it to her. You can give her a different one, if that is her thing, but all things safe and familiar should be changed over.
You wouldn’t love her if you didn’t feel mean, but stay strong - keep that end goal front and centre of your thoughts, keep reminding yourself that it is for her long term health. Good luck!
(Sorry if my previous post was confusing … I can see how you may have misunderstood about feeding her greens.)
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