Transitioning to pellets

[Ellie]

I bought some Harrisons ultra fine (high potency), to get my little guy started on pellets.

I started off trying to feed him a few pellets by hand, which he was willing to take, but also dropped. I tried sprinkling them over his seed, but he just did the same thing. The owner of our local parrot supply shop suggested I try giving his pellets during the day, and seed at night. After a few hours, he ate a few, but then started to chew on the cage bars and frantically fly around. Putting seed back in the cage calmed him down. I'm thinking that at this stage, he's not ready to go more than a few hours without a familiar source of food.

I think I've figured out how to go about this now - I placed his pellets near his top perch with a tiny sprinkle of millet on them in the morning (and also plan to start offering him fresh foods in another dish right next to it). Within a few hours, I then placed a dish with some seeds lower down in the cage. Sure enough, I started seeing him eat the pellets more frequently, occasionally flying down to eat some of the seeds.

I'm actually surprised he took to eating the pellets so quickly. But I do have some questions - is the approach I'm now trying okay? Should I move the seed dish up near his pellets in the evening, when I cover his cage up for the night? He seemed to go straight to his boing swing to sleep, where as previous nights I could hear him nibbling away at the seed dish (when it was at the top). Also, when it comes to placing food-type foraging toys (I've been tucking "finger traps" with little pieces of millet between the bars around the cage), is it best to wait until I place the seed dish in the cage, to try and encourage him to eat the pellets? Or should it be a non-issue?

[samwiseg]

Hi

Is the only reason you are trying your bird on pellets is because the shop owner suggested?

Reason is, we dont usually advise people to feed their birds pellets unless there is a health reason to. They would not eat them in the wild, and you can offer plenty of adequate nutrients and vitamins from fresh foods (list of which can be found here)

It is not really advisable to deprive them of food either really.

Where are you in the world as your avatar doesn't say? Wondered if you were in the states as there may be some members who may be able to offer your specific advise?

[Ellie]

Aug 4, 2020 10:14:30 GMT samwiseg said:

Hi

Is the only reason you are trying your bird on pellets is because the shop owner suggested?

Reason is, we dont usually advise people to feed their birds pellets unless there is a health reason to. They would not eat them in the wild, and you can offer plenty of adequate nutrients and vitamins from fresh foods (list of which can be found here)

It is not really advisable to deprive them of food either really.

Where are you in the world as your avatar doesn't say? Wondered if you were in the states as there may be some members who may be able to offer your specific advise?

Nope, I wanted to get him eating pellets, mostly because I've read that it offers a more balanced diet. Also, when I had to take one of my mothers budgies to the vet, he suggested that we try and get them started on pellets for this reason. 

Of course I'll also offer seeds (I bought Volkmans parakeet seed) and fresh foods (thanks for the list!), but since he is still young, I'd like to get him eating a variety of foods. Unfortunately I don't always find the selection of fresh food here the best, especially during the winter (and it's even worse now that this whole coronavirus thing is going on since many of the local farmers markets didn't open). I'm in Canada, btw (I need to update my profile)

[tweetiepiesmom]

I have found the whole issue of seeds vs pellets to be controversial. samwiseg is correct in that pellets are the recommended food in the US even among avian vets. I did a lot of reading and reasoning when I got Tweetie Pie concerning what food I would offer to him. Basically, my reasoning boiled down to the fact that pellets are a "manufactured" food albeit with balanced nutrition. I myself choose not each much manufactured food - breads, pasta, so called nutrition bars, ready made meals (microwaveable meals), etc. I try to each as much vegetables and fruits as I can and either eat them raw or cook them myself. I buy chicken, fish, beef and also cook it myself avoiding processed meats. Yes, I do have food allergies and sensitivities so some of that is out of necessity. So I reasoned If I am eating as close to nature as possible, why would I not do that for my budgies?

I feed my guys chop, sprouts, grass and seeds. I do like the Volkmans Super Parakeet seed, it looks very balanced. I also have the Volkmans finch seed which I mix with that because it has some seeds not in the parakeet seed.

Only you can decide what to feed your budgies. Some people are very adamant about pellets. Read the opinions out there, decide what makes sense to you, what your budgies like and go with your own opinion. Good luck!

[Ellie]

Aug 4, 2020 15:39:58 GMT tweetiepiesmom said:

I have found the whole issue of seeds vs pellets to be controversial. samwiseg is correct in that pellets are the recommended food in the US even among avian vets. I did a lot of reading and reasoning when I got Tweetie Pie concerning what food I would offer to him. Basically, my reasoning boiled down to the fact that pellets are a "manufactured" food albeit with balanced nutrition. I myself choose not each much manufactured food - breads, pasta, so called nutrition bars, ready made meals (microwaveable meals), etc. I try to each as much vegetables and fruits as I can and either eat them raw or cook them myself. I buy chicken, fish, beef and also cook it myself avoiding processed meats. Yes, I do have food allergies and sensitivities so some of that is out of necessity. So I reasoned If I am eating as close to nature as possible, why would I not do that for my budgies?

I feed my guys chop, sprouts, grass and seeds. I do like the Volkmans Super Parakeet seed, it looks very balanced. I also have the Volkmans finch seed which I mix with that because it has some seeds not in the parakeet seed.

Only you can decide what to feed your budgies. Some people are very adamant about pellets. Read the opinions out there, decide what makes sense to you, what your budgies like and go with your own opinion. Good luck!

I get what you're saying. I guess I'm just worried that I may not be able to offer enough variety, and that he'll have nutrient deficiencies over time. Maybe I'm over thinking it (although I can't imagine having a full range of variety would hurt, I mean, unless I was using a low quality pellet). Does the produce need to be organic btw? Personally, as much as I'd love to eat it myself, it's generally more expensive. I don't mind buying it for my budgie (especially if I can get to a stage of making chop to freeze), but again, my access is limited right now because of this virus issue.

Glad to hear the Volkmans was a good choice! I was also given a free bag of TOP's and was told to soak it for 8-12 hours. I haven't tried it yet, but will soon.

I don't think the pellet consumption went as well today... I did the same thing as yesterday, and he only ate a few pellets, then went straight for the seed I put in there late this morning. When I moved it to the top of the cage for the night, he again head straight for it, and even after finishing eating, just refused to move off the dish.

[yellowfacedviolet]

Transition is a marathon not a sprint. That he's accepting the new food at all is a major breakthrough. Slow and steady and you'll get there. Also, there's excellent advice about transition to pellets on the Harrisons website.

tweetiepiesmom , in her excellent post, accurately described this issue of diet as a controversial one. And I hope you did not feel unnecessarily challenged by an earlier post asking about why you are making the transition. There are a few of us here who will support you on this. Again, as my colleague said, you do your homework, consider the advice of your vet, and make an informed decision. I did, and I wish you the results that i have had since I made the switch 8 years ago.

It is true that on this forum, those of us who use pellet-based diets, specifically Harrisons, are in the minority, but that is not the case elsewhere and certainly not the case in avian veterinary practice. To expand on one of tweetiepiesmom 's points, it is true that American and Canadian vets initiated this movement, but even a cursory search of avian veterinary practices on the internet finds that there's been something of a sea change in this regard, from London to Melbourne, with pellet-based diet being advocated, and in many cases a specific endorsement for Harrisons.

I'm not in the business of attempting to change anyone's mind on this but only speak up to support those who are inquiring about or are having issues pertaining to transition to pellets.


But I do make this observation. Not once in all of our discussions over the past two years about seeds have I or anyone using a pellet-based diet chimed in to caution seed users about their choice. Yet when the shoe is on the other foot, when someone inquiring about pellets posts a question, they are almost always challenged. I do hope this will stop.

[tweetiepiesmom]

Thank you yellowfacedviolet!!! I will applaud anyone who does their own research and comes up with their own decision.

Concerning the chop Ellie, there are many people who make up a batch of chop, portion it out in single serve portions and freeze it. I myself prefer to use freeze dried chop and sprouts. It is more expensive but my guys do eat it. If there is a fresh veggie or herb that I'm eating, I'll offer some to my guys. It is not always organic because sometimes organic is not available.

I was reading a suggestion somewhere (sorry forgot where) that said to moisten the pellets, make them into little balls, roll those in the seed and offer that to your budgies to help them transition to pellets. I may try that as an occasional meal because I do worry that they are not getting enough variety.

[Ellie]

yellowfacedviolet, Yep, that much I understand. My mother has two budgies that are solely living on seeds with the occasional egg supplement thrown in. She told me that they wouldn't eat anything else, but finally, I offered them apples (and not just any apples - they only accepted gala apples). It has taken 3 years (although honestly, I think my mother gave up, and it was only my weekend visits that they were given the options). This is the kind of thing I'd like to avoid in my own bird.

I do understand the logic of both points of view, so I don't really feel challenged. It's more of an issue of being unsure of how to go about things myself. I figured if I got started on giving variety at this stage, it would give my budgie a taste for different things, and hopefully the long term result will mean he gets the best nutrition possible. Kind of a best of all worlds approach.

tweetiepiesmom, I'll probably give batch freezing a try, once I start seeing him try a variety of foods. I didn't even know freeze dried existed for birds (I've seen it for dogs). I don't think that the local parrot shop carries freeze dried by the looks of it, but it's possible that once I'm able to get Danny (name pending lol) a vet appointment, they might be able to tell me where I might find it.

The rolled pellet and seed balls are a good suggestion. I'll also check out the Harrison's website like yellowfacedviolet pointed out. Birdie bread was one of the suggestions the shop made, if I had little success with the pellets alone.

[birdguhl]

As a feeder of pellets along with a variety of other foods, I think the most inclusive approach works well. If health problems arise, already having budgies used to eating pellets means that it is not a task which has to be tackled in the context of illness.

[tweetiepiesmom]

Ellie here is a good vendor in Canada who has freeze dried as well as other food stuffs for birds. I checked her out and found her to be very good and she's very responsive to emails. Since she's in Canada, the shipping costs are too high for me and I've located two suppliers in the US.
www.avianorganics.com/

[Ellie]

tweetiepiesmom Thanks! I'll check it out!

[samwiseg]

I didn't mean to seem negative towards pellets Ellie! But as tweetiepiesmom mentioned it is a contraversial subject and everyone is entitled to their own views as to what is best for their birds

Am glad you have been able to find members who are able to help you more on this topic who have had more experience

[Ellie]

Aug 9, 2020 10:38:10 GMT samwiseg said:

I didn't mean to seem negative towards pellets Ellie ! But as tweetiepiesmom mentioned it is a contraversial subject and everyone is entitled to their own views as to what is best for their birds

Am glad you have been able to find members who are able to help you more on this topic who have had more experience

No worries @samwiseg. I can always make alterations in what I'm doing, based on how he's doing.

Right now he's essentially a seed junkie, will occasionally eat pellets (mostly from my hand), and so far will not go near anything fresh. I managed to get him to get a small taste of apple, and one nibble of spinach. I think the fresh produce will be a baby step kind of thing.

[tweetiepiesmom]

Keep tryin Ellie, It will feel so good when he finally eats what you offer!

[Ellie]

Aug 9, 2020 15:22:09 GMT tweetiepiesmom said:

Keep tryin Ellie , It will feel so good when he finally eats what you offer!

Yup, I'll keep at it. I think for most the part, he's afraid of the foods. I've tried putting slices of things in on treat clips, as well as in a tiny dice. But for most the part, if he jumps to his second dish and sees something non-seed, he flies away.

On the bright side, I just caught him eating a few pellets from one of the dishes, all on his own. He probably only eats 10-15 of those pellets a day, but at least it's a start.