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Post by criswell on Feb 7, 2022 17:26:04 GMT
I had a reply from the vets this morning about getting Dexter tested for feather loss viruses - PBFD and polyoma. it's £224 for both virus tests to be done on a blood sample, and they can take the sample with or without anaesthetic. It's £184 to using feathers and they would have to pluck a few feathers from Dexter. Either way it'll be a bit stressful for Dexter. The feather test could still be positive if Dexter has virus on his feathers but isn't actually infected. The vet also mentioned that the PBFD virus can live for year in some environments which is quite worrying. The vet can test an environmental sample for me and will provide a swap so I can collect a sample from the cage. That'll also be £184
I've been looking online and Avigenics have good reviews and it's £10 to test from blood and feathers. I don't think I could pluck any feathers from Dexter though. I emailed them about testing an environmental swab and they can do that too. So I will take a couple of swabs from the cage and send them off.
It seems sensible to start with environmental tests as that won't stress Dexter and I wouldn't want Dexter to get the all clear but still have PBFD virus in the room. So that's the plan. I just need to check a few more details of how to take the swabs.
If the tests are negative that won't rule out Dexter being infected but it's a first step in deciding if it's safe to bring another budgie into the house.
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Post by tweetiepiesmom on Feb 7, 2022 18:04:33 GMT
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Post by criswell on Feb 7, 2022 19:53:27 GMT
Thanks tweetiepiesmom I do use F10 to clean the cage but there are a few areas like Dean Stockwell's swing and his favourite bell that don't get cleaned so often so often as they are hard to reach in the cage. So I will swab those and all places I know he's been in his last few days. I've read that F10 is effective against PBFD and APV so I will clean the cage really thoroughly. I need to take some swabs first so I can find out which virus is present. Then I will clean everything thoroughly and do some swabs again. I'm glad I've found somewhere that will do the testing more cheaply as I'll be able to repeat the testing after cleaning. I'm concerned about the rest of the room - carpet, curtains, sofa as they won't be easy to disinfect. If the cage swabs do detect PBFD then I'll try swabbing other places in the room. I've got all the info I need about taking the swabs and I'll get them in the post on Wednesday (when David is allowed to stop isolating. I've got to stay in until Friday) and it takes 5 - 7 days for results from the time they get the samples.
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Post by ffiscool on Feb 7, 2022 20:13:26 GMT
After I rehomed Bailey, as I knew he was the cause of my issues back then, I just wiped all those things with F10. I got the wipes. The carpet was different but you could maybe wipe the walls, woodwork and then keep hoovering the carpet.
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Post by criswell on Feb 7, 2022 22:39:54 GMT
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Post by criswell on Feb 24, 2022 19:18:35 GMT
I've not got very far with getting a cage sample tested for PBFD. I thought I had but some confusion has arisen.
I found one company that does environmental tests and sent them a message to ask how to take the sample and they didn't reply. Then I saw they had a lot of bad reviews on facebook so decided best not to pursue things with them.
I found another company that tests blood and feathers and emailed to ask if they could do an environmental sample and they said yes and told me how to collect the sample using a cotton bud. Their online payment system didn't process the payment so they said they'd phone to take payment when the sample arrived. So I sent off the sample. They phoned. I paid. Nothing was said about what type of sample I sent so I thought all was well.
It's now a week later and I'd not had a result so I emailed to ask when I could expect it and I received a reply to say they needed blood and feathers and couldn't process my swab sample. I just gave them a call. I spoke to the woman who had replied to my email and I explained that I'd been told they could process a swab for me. She still has the sample and it hasn't been contaminated so she is going to check with the lab in the morning and let me know. She wasn't aware that they could test anything other than blood or feathers. She did say that she had talked to someone last week which must have been me but that phone call just resulted in me paying for the test. It does get complicated when there are different people dealing with the same query, and I should probably have printed out the email about environmental samples and put it in with the swab.
It's not a big deal if they can't process my sample and she said they will refund my money if they can't do it. I used to work doing PCR so know it would be easy enough to use the swab as a source of DNA. It just depends on if anyone in the lab has tried that before.
The vet can do an environmental test for me for £184 which is rather steep and the same price as getting Dexter tested, so if I can't get my environmental sample done by the company I sent it to I won't get the vet to do it but will get Dexter tested instead. I don't want to disturb him at the moment as he is just starting to get more relaxed on his own and I don't want to stress him out again with a trip to the vets. I'm still not sure that I want them to take a blood sample as I'm so worried that he'll die as a result and then I would never forgive myself. They can test feathers but PCR testing is so sensitive that it will detect virus contamination on the surface of the feathers and might be positive even if he is not actually infected. But then if he still has virus on the outside of his feathers he would be a risk to a new bird so it would be useful to know that anyway I guess.
This is what the vet said about blood samples " The best way to test is with a blood test. This is perfectly doable, but there is always a small risk with budgies and stress from restraint - although it's rare that we would lose one during sampling. We can take blood conscious from a vein in the neck. Otherwise, we can also anaesthetise - but there is a risk with anaesthesia too. While I anaesthetise every other psittacine, budgies can be sampled fairly easily conscious."
It's going to be months before we could introduce him to a new friend as I need to wait a couple of months after disinfecting the cage, so I won't rush to take Dexter for a test.
This is my new plan: 1) Find out tomorrow if the company can process sample 2) Thoroughly disinfect cage and replace everything replaceable. 3) Take Dexter for a test via feather sample in April (Easter holidays so easier to get him to the vet as David has 2 weeks off work and more time for Dexter to settle) 4) Find a new friend if Dexter doesn't have PBFD
Sorry for speaking my brains here and going on a bit! It's helped me get my thoughts in order! I was feeling a bit down about it but I feel much better now. So thank you!
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Post by Loz on Feb 24, 2022 22:01:18 GMT
This was stressful to read criswell , I can only try to imagine how it is for you living it. The goal is a worthy one and you are clearly attempting to follow the path of least harm so I can only applaud your efforts whilst crossing my fingers that you get a happy outcome for all this. Please continue to keep us updated on progress, of which I hope they'll be plenty in the near future. Good luck with the veterinarian process.
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Post by tweetiepiesmom on Feb 24, 2022 22:24:45 GMT
You have done a thorough thought process on this. From my standpoint, its great to post it here. Someone may see something different that will help you. I too think you're doing what is best for Dexter and any new budgie you might get. Hoping for the best for you both.
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Post by criswell on Feb 24, 2022 22:30:13 GMT
Thank you loz. I'm sure it will all work itself out. I'm trying not to be stressed about it but any little hiccup in my plans gets me a bit down at the moment. I will definitely keep you posted. Generally Dexter is doing pretty well and not pining for a new friend, so I am probably more anxious than he is. He's giving his toys a lot more attention and this evening he had a long chat to his piece of broccoli. Normally I'd be home all day but it's half term this week so we've had some errands to run and allotment work to do which is making me feel bad for Dexter being at home on his own. I think he will cope if we can't get him a new pal but I hope we can do as it would be nice to see him chattering to a buddy again.
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Post by criswell on Feb 24, 2022 22:40:44 GMT
Thank you tweetiepiesmom. It's really good to have you all here to talk to. It must have taken me at least an hour to write that post but it did me a lot of good. I really do appreciate the support from everyone. David, my OH, is just as worried about Dexter as me and between us we are trying to make sure that Dexter isn't on his own for too long. I've told him my plan and he agrees. My next worry is how Dexter is going to react to me taking his cage away so I can thoroughly clean it. He will still have access to the spare cage but he's not used to going in there. I could pop him in the carrier I use for the vets. I shall have to give this some more thought too.
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Post by willowsmum on Feb 24, 2022 23:38:47 GMT
I'm sorry about the hiccup in the sample testing criswell , that's so frustrating. Hopefully they will still be able to test the swab for you. I think problems are a lot more manageable when you have a plan in place but I agree that a setback can make things seem insurmountable until you find an alternative solution. You have obviously thought every aspect of this through and considered the best possible outcome for Dexter so thank you for thinking out loud and taking us through it with you, I'm sure it will help others on the forum as well as yourself. Maybe a solution to removing Dexter's cage for the deep clean will come to you if you sleep on it. Sometimes I think we just need a bit of time to mull things over in the background before an answer pops into our heads. Well, I do anyway! Keep thinking things through and let us know how it goes x
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Post by Hezz on Feb 25, 2022 0:36:30 GMT
I don’t have much more to offer, criswell, except that I don’t see any flaws in your plans, anything overlooked, or other obvious solutions. All the best with getting some results and sooner rather than later. It is all such a kerfuffle, but doing the right thing for Dexter and his future new friend. Xx
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Post by ffiscool on Feb 25, 2022 0:58:32 GMT
I agree, having a plan and putting it on paper helps. It’s a positive step. So frustrating re the sample.
I’m glad Dexter is doing better. It’s hard isn’t it, knowing what to do re a friend. I think see what happens as you say with the sample first
If Dexter was out of the cage, could you just have the travel cage there, for him to land whilst you clean?
Another thought, expensive but maybe less stress if you think Dexter would cope better, buy the exact same cage/v similar and new toys to set it up as it is now? I don’t know what you have now, so it may not be possible even if you wanted. At least the deep clean wouldn’t be necessary. I’ve only ever had a single bud, so the cage has not been that big or expensive.
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Post by criswell on Feb 25, 2022 10:48:08 GMT
Thank you willowsmum , Hezz and ffiscool . I got my call back this morning and the lab is happy to process the sample so it has been sent on to them. So I'll have a result soon. It would have been helpful if the emails I had were signed by someone and then I could have put their name as a reference for the sample and it would have avoided some confusion. ffiscool I actually had considered buying another cage. I have a piano 6 and Zooplus still sell it at a reasonable price so it's a possibility. I've added that as a potential option in the plan.
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Post by Ira on Feb 25, 2022 17:46:07 GMT
criswell just catching up on this. Don't have much to add, but Pippin had a blood sample taken conscious and came through fine, and he's my most scaredy.
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