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Post by Loz on Mar 24, 2022 19:11:31 GMT
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Oct 6, 2011 7:41:27 GMT
Marianne Marlow
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George, Daisy, Iris, Billy, Peter, Chipper, Dinku, Barney, Ayla and Rocky
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Post by Marianne Marlow on Mar 24, 2022 22:08:40 GMT
I've watched the videos and I see what you mean about Eeyore hassling Patch. But I cannot help but think there is a reason for it. He seems to want Patch to play but Patch doesn't have the energy. Does he know Patch isn't feeling well? he feeds him and Patch takes the food.
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Post by Loz on Mar 24, 2022 22:28:13 GMT
Patch and Eeyore in many ways act like a bonded pair but Eeyore is just full-on for much of the day.
I am fifty-fifty on whether Patch is ill or if he is just reacting to the onslaught. He can be active and on some occasions, when left alone, he is running around on the floor, foraging like a good'un. Other times he's just trying to sleep.
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Oct 6, 2011 7:41:27 GMT
Marianne Marlow
Administrator
George, Daisy, Iris, Billy, Peter, Chipper, Dinku, Barney, Ayla and Rocky
Posts: 28,803
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Post by Marianne Marlow on Mar 24, 2022 22:32:06 GMT
Well if a budgie gets unwanted attention, usually they will put the other bird in their place. Patch isn't telling Eeyore to buzz off, so he's just carrying on with it.
There's just something about the way Patch stands which makes me think he's unwell. I'd love to be wrong about that.
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Post by Loz on Mar 24, 2022 22:42:46 GMT
I know what you mean, Marianne Marlow. However ... Shortly after Patch and Squeak joined the flock, their stances changed - they went from normal budgie-shape, standing upright, to a chick-stance. It was a very noticeable transition. In the past few days, Squeak has stood upright again, sometimes reverting to chick-shape. I've not seen Patch stand up straight since quarantine.
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Oct 6, 2011 7:41:27 GMT
Marianne Marlow
Administrator
George, Daisy, Iris, Billy, Peter, Chipper, Dinku, Barney, Ayla and Rocky
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Post by Marianne Marlow on Mar 24, 2022 22:44:57 GMT
You mean in a submissive stance?
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Post by Loz on Mar 24, 2022 22:49:04 GMT
Yes, it is submissive behaviour. The young of all bird species do it, I believe. It's a way of saying to older, dominant individuals, "Hey, I'm a baby, no threat here, be nice to me, maybe feed me?". Its normal behaviour until the young bird grows a bit and things even out more.
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Post by criswell on Mar 24, 2022 23:57:50 GMT
I hope Patch is well, but like Marianne Marlow I am worried about him. When Randolph Carter was poorly back in Jan 2020 he was still doing all his budgie things and being active when he was awake, and if I'd only seen him at those times I wouldn't have thought there was anything wrong. It amazes me how they can carry on with their daily tasks even playing and singing when not very well at all. I know I've said before that Eeyore's behaviour to patch is like Criswell's behaviour to Dexter, but Dexter wasn't so passive about it as Patch is and he would move away or fly off when it got too much for him. Or he would squawk at Criswell to back off. I do hope that a little time away from Eeyore will help and if he's still very quiet after getting more rest I really would take him to a vet.
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Post by Hezz on Mar 25, 2022 1:04:50 GMT
To clarify, the lactated ringers’ solution is only helpful f a bird is not eating or drinking on its own, or hasn’t been able to for whatever reason, OR has a bad case of diarrhoea, as it is designed to replace lost electrolytes.
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Post by blueelephant on Mar 25, 2022 4:29:45 GMT
Just catching up, but gosh those videos. Eeyore is full on. Did the vet see these before you spoke on the phone?
The reason I ask if the vet saw them is that I agree with the others that it's strange he does nothing about the onslaught from Eeyore. He seems fluffed and huddled and looks like he just doesn't have the energy to deal with it.
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Post by Loz on Mar 25, 2022 6:24:14 GMT
The vet has not seen the videos.
I've played back the telephone conversation and I believe that the vet was advising on not enough information - my fault.
I will try to get the vet to look at the videos. Thinking back, I believe the vet was most concerned that Patch would be killed or injured in an attack. I don't believe aggression is the issue here. After a lot of consideration and seeing the posts I've read here, I believe Patch is ill. Although he's eating well and has periods of activity, Patch is not showing a normal degree of activity over the course of the day. I believe Eeyore is trying to gee Patch up and is perhaps frustrated at the lack of response. Certainly, when Patch is running around, foraging on the floor, Eeyore is happy enough and acts in an acceptable manner, for the most part.
Back to the vet, I think. The vet I spoke to yesterday is a local one and I don't have a feeling yet about how good they are with birds. My usual vet is a fair distance away in Portsmouth but is on leave this week. She's not an avian specialist but I do know she is dedicated to animal welfare and she does listen carefully. It also helps than I am registered with her practice!
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Oct 6, 2011 7:41:27 GMT
Marianne Marlow
Administrator
George, Daisy, Iris, Billy, Peter, Chipper, Dinku, Barney, Ayla and Rocky
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Post by Marianne Marlow on Mar 25, 2022 9:13:12 GMT
I hear you Hezz. The reason I mentioned it is that I have had sick birds sit on the seed troughs for long periods of time and when I approach they pretend to eat (or drink). So to be on the safe side, I thought the solution might help. loz, have you managed to isolate Patch's dropping to see if they are normal? To clarify, the lactated ringers’ solution is only helpful f a bird is not eating or drinking on its own, or hasn’t been able to for whatever reason, OR has a bad case of diarrhoea, as it is designed to replace lost electrolytes.
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Post by Loz on Mar 25, 2022 9:29:16 GMT
Marianne Marlow, I haven't yet started the isolation. I was observing Patch for a couple of minutes this morning, then took a four-minute video which I will upload when I get the chance. It gave me pause. I will try to get some more input from a vet today before I take further action. Basically, Patch was acting very normally from the moment he properly woke up and Eeyore was behaving himself very well. It indicates that Patch's passivity drives some of Eeyore's behaviour but how much does Eeyore's bad behaviour drive Patch's passivity? I plan to cage Patch separately tonight, that will give me a clue as to the state of his droppings.
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Oct 6, 2011 7:41:27 GMT
Marianne Marlow
Administrator
George, Daisy, Iris, Billy, Peter, Chipper, Dinku, Barney, Ayla and Rocky
Posts: 28,803
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Post by Marianne Marlow on Mar 25, 2022 9:32:56 GMT
Sounds good. I hope Patch has a good day and manages to get some Peace.
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Post by Loz on Mar 25, 2022 9:45:23 GMT
Me too.
Its hard, I've been harbouring some hard feelings towards Eeyore for his treatment of Patch but now I wonder if there's some sort of budgie care & helpfulness going on here.
For instance, when Chocobo did a Tigger-like pounce on Patch just now, Eeyore barreled in to ensure the lad's safety. There was no problem, Patch didn't miss a beat with his foraging but Eeyore was on the case!
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