Sam at the vet

[jellybean]

Around 18 months ago I had Sam at the vet when he developed a feather cyst, this has been an ongoing problem ever since, it is high up on his left wing and has fused some of his primary feathers together preventing him now from being able to fly.

So, this in turn has made him a bit lazy, he still moves around the cage, but that still doesn't give him enough exercise to keep him trim, therefore he put some weight on and developed fatty liver, which I am keeping on top of, and he has lost 12G in weight when the vet weighed him this morning.

But, being a bit tubby and sitting about has given him a sore on his right foot, I have been bathing it in salt water and applying Fucidin, which helped a bit but didn't clear it up, so off to the vet we went.

I have to keep bathing with a cotton bud with salt and water, but apply vaseline, which the vet said would probably stay on longer.

She has also given two lots of meds.....Marbocyl 0.03ml and Metacam 0.06ml until I take him back for a check up on 4th January.

She gave me a roll of vet wrap, and I also bought a roll, she advised that I wrap the perches.

I took pictures of the cage and set up before the vet visit, she thought some of the perches too thick, but I disagreed, she also said the plastic mirror swing (which they both share at night as a sleeping perch) was bad for Sam's feet, and told me to buy a wooden one, I don't think I could get a wooden one that they both could share, so I vet wrapped that too.

She asked about their seed mix, I told her I used Haith's seed, and had done for years, and had moved form their Budgie Bravo, to a Foreign Finch Mix, she looked both of these up on the computer, and said the Bravo was a better health choice even though there were groats, as there is too much millet based seed in the FFM, and said "they are not finches".

She's a very nice vet and knows about birds, but, I felt I got a slap on the wrist this morning  

Total cost £85.03
I then came home and ordered more Guardian Angel which she said to give on alternate days with Milk thistle, which cost £16.80.

Think i'll need to put their dig money up 

[Marianne Marlow]

I thought groats were way more unhealthy than millet seed when they have too much of them?

[jellybean]

 
That was my argument too Marianne.

She looked up a seed brand on the computer to show me, I'm certain it was BUCKTONS budgie seed, i'd never heard of it, she also asked, had I tried him on pellets, I said i'd tried pellets in the past (not with Sam) and none of my birds would eat them.

[ariella]

I wouldn’t have liked being contradicted either. I would stick to whatever you think is best jellybean. You’ve been taking such good care of Sam and I understand you want to make his life easier, not change it altogether.
Vet fees aren’t cheap, that’s for sure. I hope Sam’s foot shows improvement soon.

[jellybean]

If anyone has any input I'd be glad to hear it 🥺

[criswell]

I hope Sam's foot gets better soon. It's good that he has already lost a little bit of weight. Vets do seem to want to get budgies off seeds. My vet always recommends nutriberries but they just don't seem like a very natural food for budgies with the fruit and nuts that seems much more suitable for parrots andhave corn syrup plus the classic ones have gelatin in them. My boys didn't take to them. I've not been able to convince them to eat pellets either, and fights broke out!

Dexter has guardian angel in his water everyday. I started giving it to the daily on the recommendation of the bird care co. to help Dean Stockwell's immune system and Dexter has been very healthy during that time so I'm happy to keep giving it too him.

[Hezz]

Sorry you had a less than encouraging vet visit, jellybean. I feel a little responsible for your dilemma as I know I recommended going on to the finch mix. While I don’t know your particular seed mix, the one I use (finch) is basically the same as the budgie mix but just without the oats. I think it also has a small amount of charcoal as well which I don’t think is a bad thing. I find that comment “they’re not finches” rather condescending, really and in the wild our finches eat basically the same things that the budgies do - seeding grasses.

Surely she wasn’t suggesting your birds eat pellets but no seed? Good luck with getting Sam’s foot healed, but what about the initial problem, the feather cyst(s)? Did she have a solution for that? While some seem to resolve themselves over time, I’ve been told that to properly treat repeat offenders the cyst needs to be delt with surgically.
This article below suggests that a diet high in amino acids can help prevent feather cysts from developing, a bit late for Sam, but may still be of some use to you:
beautyofbirds.com/feather-cysts/

[jellybean]

Hezz, please don't feel responsible for the seed advice, advice from you is always gratefully received.

I'm at a loss now as to what seed mix to give 🤔

Both sat on the corner rope perches yesterday for ages after I had vet wrapped the perches 😱 But, all is good now they've realised they won't be eaten.

Where the cyst has now developed, was a couple of problem feathers that when he knocked them they bled, so vet removed the problem feathers a while back, then the cyst seemed to develop.

Yesterday I asked could anything be done to remove it, and she mentioned surgery, but said there was no guarantee it would cure it completely.

Sam (the mirror man) will sit in front of anything that's shiny, she suggested removing the mirrors to see if it will make him more mobile.....Any suggestions?

I'm off to bathe his foot and give his meds, which is a nightmare, Sam could wriggle himself through the eye of a needle 😂

Question:- Can I still give Milk Thistle and Guardian Angel while giving them their meds??

[tweetiepiesmom]

I think that's a good question for the makers of Guardian Angel - Bird Care Co? I know with humans, there are some meds that you are not supposed to take mineral supplements (magnesium, iron, etc) within 4 hours because they effect absorption of the med. Don't know if that's the case here.

[jellybean]

Question:- Can I still give Milk Thistle and Guardian Angel while giving them their meds??

I phoned the Vet, receptionist spoke to a vet nurse who confirmed MT was still OK, she thought GA would be fine too, but wouldn't commit because it wasn't one of their products and wasn't administered by them 🙄😏

[skysmum]

Poor Sam, it’s a problem when they can’t fly about anymore, one thing seems to lead to another. I’ve always fed mine Johnson and Jeff jellybean , no grouts, it’s a good mix.

[jellybean]

I thought the Foreign Finch Mix was good skysmum, its got no groats, but the vet said it has too much millet.

Can you give me some info on the ingredients of yours or send me a link.

[jellybean]

Hezz, this is a paragraph from the link you sent me, would it help Sam if I did this and any idea where I would buy such a thing:-

Mary was able to loosen some of the feather cysts with fresh leaf aloe gel without the usual loss of blood that is associated with removing these cysts (which can be dangerous, potentially even life-threatening). 

[Hezz]

I have no experience with feather cysts, JB, but you could only but try. I read the aloe gel as being the gel inside the individual aloe leaves, so if you have a plant you are right to go. Not sure whether it would grow in the depths of winter in the depths of Scotland??

[willowsmum]

So sorry that Sam is going through this jellybean, poor lad it seems like he's having one problem on top of another You certainly give your boys the best of care though so I would stick with your gut feeling about what's best for them.

I've heard of Bucktons (possibly on Amazon?) but never used it. I'm not sure how 'right' it is but I've always aimed for a mix of 50% canary seed and 50% mixed millet (white, yellow, red, panicum etc) with a tiny few groats added to keep Bramble happy, although I've usually had to mix a couple of plain seed mixes in order to achieve this. I thought that was why the finch mixes were good as they were higher in canary seed and lower in millet. It's the content rather than the name of the mix that counts though so she was a bit off with her 'not a finch' comment, especially when you are there looking for her advice and worried about poor Sam.

I agree with Hezz as I also took the aloe comment to mean the gel squeezed from inside the plant leaves. I've got a couple of aloe vera houseplants (I think they came from Lidl originally) and if you cut off a leaf and squeeze it (a bit like a tube of toothpaste) it releases a lot of sticky, clear gel. It's really soothing to the skin, especially if you put the leaf in the fridge first, and it can be used for burns, rashes and sunburn (don't get too many cases of the latter round here ). It's quite sticky at first but absorbs quickly. I've used it as a home remedy but never for the budgies. You can probably also buy tubes of gel containing aloe vera but I'm not sure what the other additives would be.

Fingers crossed Sam is feeling better soon and that he forgives you for the medicine administration x